Latest Resource
Raising Children with Special Needs: Advocacy, Support, and Resources for Parents Some children don’t follow the typical developmental path. They may experience speech delays, learning differences, medical complexities, or developmental challenges that require...
When our sons are struggling, the instinct to jump in and fix things can be hard to resist. But sometimes the best thing we can do is walk alongside them, giving them the space, support, and connection they need to work through challenges themselves. In this episode, Suzy talks with educator Jason Larocque about the idea of “accompaniment,” why authenticity and trust matter to boys, and how side-by-side conversations can make it easier for them to open up.
Jason also shares practical guidance for recognizing when it’s time for an adult to step in, the subtle ways boys may signal when they’re hurting, and how parents can create a safe space for honest conversations without judgment. They also explore the importance of modeling physical and emotional wellness for our sons. Jason’s advice for moms is simple: “Walk with them, don’t push them, and don’t pull them.”
Jason Larocque is an educator, coach, and leader who has spent more than two decades working with boys and young men. His work focuses on academic excellence, leadership, health and wellness, and helping boys develop into resilient, emotionally mature men. He also teaches graduate-level courses at Endicott College and works as a CrossFit instructor.
Jason believes true strength comes from understanding who you are and what you value, while developing the vulnerability, self-compassion, and willingness to ask for help that allow boys and men to build strong relationships and lead healthy lives.
The information provided in this podcast is for general informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice. Consult with a qualified professional for specific guidance.
Subscribe to our newsletter for podcast updates and more.
As parents, when we see our son struggling, our instinct is to jump in and fix it. I know mine was. But sometimes what our boys need the most isn’t someone to solve the problem, it’s someone willing to walk alongside them while they figure it out.
My guest today is Jason Larocque, an educator who has spent 20 years working in all-boys middle and high schools. His work focuses on fostering academic excellence, masculinity, leadership, health, and wellness. Jason, welcome to the Mothers of Boys podcast.
Jason Larocque: Thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate the opportunity to talk about boys.
Suzy Shaw: The moms appreciate you being here too, because being an educator in that space, I’m sure you have a lot to share with us.
Jason Larocque: Yeah, people often ask me what it’s like to teach middle school boys. And it’s pretty much you have to spend a day in my shoes to really understand the world that we occupy here. But it’s a blessing, it’s a privilege, and I feel really grateful to be journeying with them.
Suzy Shaw: So Jason, you reached out to me, which I truly appreciated, and you made it clear about your passion for helping boys become young, healthy men. So where did that passion begin for you?
Jason Larocque: Yeah, I mean, I think being a student-athlete, spending most of my time with my teammates and my male friends- those relationships were really formative for me. When I became an educator, that teacher-coach model was something that was really important to me. So I’ve always been drawn to that setting of working with athletes, working with boys, working with students.
And I think really the passion for working with boys specifically came through in my doctoral work, where I had to reflect on some aspect of my sociocultural identity. And for me, it was really the forces of gender in my life. And I think through that reflection, through that time, I spent critically analyzing my development, my growth as a young man.
I heard someone say one time that we were most fond of the age group where we were the most vulnerable. And I think that for me, looking back on the age 11-18 time was a time where there was a lot of challenging family dynamics. It was a time when I was an only child trying to navigate that world with a family that was going through some challenges. I think I just see the boys I work with, I see their dynamics, I see their challenges as something I’ve already been through. So in many ways, it’s a way to rewrite the story for them in ways that are more healthy and more productive than perhaps some of the experiences I had or the ways that I coped when I didn’t know any better.
Working with boys at the age of 12 to 18, and you touch on it in your book, but I think there’s this slightly entertaining and amusing delusion that middle school boys have where they really want to be independent and they want to have influence and power and control, but they don’t have the skills or the competencies yet to do it. So they’re oftentimes trying to act the part. And as we know, that doesn’t always go so well. And I think that’s the endearing part of their innocence, and that tension that they have between independence and inability is part of the reason why I love it so much.
But where things have changed for me and my understanding of boys and my support of boys, I think when I first started the work, I was interested in trying to establish this idea of order and strictness and rule of law. And it was this kind of responsibility I felt that I owed the boys to get them ready for life. Right. They’re trying to compete. They’re trying to win. They’re trying to succeed in this game of life. And that my role really as another man was to show them the rules and get them to measure up to those rules so that they can succeed.
And I think now the priority for me is that there’ll be time for that. What they need at a younger age is this experience of love and connection. And it’s kind of related to Maslow’s Hierarchy, but if I feel loved and connected, then I am more likely to be able to do the things that you want me to do. But if I skip right to the rule of law and the strictness and the order, but I haven’t established that relational piece, and I don’t feel loved, I don’t feel connected, you’re not going to get the best from me. So for me, I’ve flipped the order. I feel like the order is different. I think once I take care of their human need for love and connection, then they’re more likely to accomplish the outcomes that I hope for them.
Suzy Shaw: So you were just mentioning about trying to support boys’ needs for love and trust, I would imagine is a big part of that as well. So do you find that difficult in today’s culture?
Jason Larocque: I find that boys have this unspoken skepticism of, like, “what do you want from me?” They’re trying to get a quick understanding of your motives. And I think if you walk in with your own agenda, I think that’s showing them something, versus you walking in and you want to know what their agenda is. You’re curious or you want to observe them and you want to understand what the hook is for them in that moment.
I think boys are very in tune with like, what is it that you want for me and what is your personal agenda? And I think that goes back to all the research that we have about boys, that they really want authenticity from their adults that they work with. And they can tell if you’re being inauthentic, and that’s a deal breaker for them. You don’t have to be perfect, but you have to be honest, and you have to be authentic.
And I’ve seen boys connect with many different- the same boy can connect with many different kinds of boys. So they’re not looking for people that are like them. You can be different than them, but you have to be authentic. And I think that’s really what the boys are keying in on, that early assessment of you as a teacher, a family member, an ally, a coach, is they want to know, are you authentic? And is your agenda your agenda or is it something that we’re going to kind of create together?
Suzy Shaw: Right. That makes a lot of sense. So I’m curious what you think has changed in how we look as a culture at boys. When I was growing up, there was very much the attitude of “toughen up.” And I think that was not helpful. So what do you think has changed in our lifetimes?
Jason Larocque: So I think what’s different now is I think people, not everyone, but many more people in society are more open to a conversation about children, boys, girls, how do we just create more humane experiences for them so that they can be fully human?
I think a lot of times the gender roles that we all occupy and the standards and the norms that we develop for boys and girls is dehumanizing in many ways. It’s the same experience, it’s different kinds of experiences. So for me, it’s like what’s good for girls is oftentimes good for boys, which is good for all people, which is trying to celebrate full humanity.
Suzy Shaw: Right. I love that. So when we first talked, you introduced me to the idea of accompaniment, walking alongside with your son rather than always trying to fix or solve the problem. So can you give us some examples of what that looks like in reality?
Jason Larocque: I think it’s doing things together, being human together, and also leaving space for the messiness of life. And I think when a child, when my children or when my students, or athletes present with an issue or a challenge, it’s being relatable to them so that they are safe and that it’s a space where they can process, where they can talk about it on their terms; they can talk about it at their pace. And sometimes it means just sitting in silence.
As adults, we often feel like we have to have the answer or have the perfect word or have it solved within 10 minutes. And sometimes it just means a validation of the experience, like speaking to a boy like, “Hey buddy, this is really hard and I don’t have an answer, but I’m going to sit here with you and you can express yourself however you want. I know this is difficult. You don’t have to talk, you can cry, you can just sit here, but I’m going to be here with you. And if and when you’re ready to talk, I’m here. I’m not going to try to fix this for you. I know you can solve this, but you know where to find me and we’re going to do this together. Because I have been down that road, and I’m maybe even currently on the same road.”
But I think what also has to happen is that you then have to show your children or your students that you too need accompaniment so that they know that it’s a human experience, not something that there’s a power dynamic. So I might come home from work and say to my kids or see students in the hallway and say, “I had a really hard day yesterday and I don’t know what to do about it and just share that this is part of being human.”
Suzy Shaw: I think something that came to me slowly as a parent was: “seek first to understand and then to be understood.” I mean, that’s a great line, but in practice it takes practice.
And the car was one of my favorite tools because if I could be driving in the car with a boy, or my son in the back or even next to me, it was an opportunity for some reason for more honest conversations to happen because we weren’t staring at each other.
Jason Larocque: Yeah, we call that side-by-side relationships. It’s like boys and men oftentimes really don’t love the face-to-face relationships where you have to look each other in the eyes. When we do, we often love to have breakfast. That seems like a very innocent way to approach a face-to-face conversation between men because, again, I’m doing something. I’m eating, but I have found that boys are much more willing to engage if you go for a walk or if you’re on a drive or if you’re shooting hoops or if you’re building Legos because you’re doing that together and that accompanying piece. And oftentimes you’re side-by-side doing it. You’re not necessarily like this intense face-to-face moment.
So I think what you’re talking about is very true. That side-by-side accompaniment communication is something that just is a little more accessible for a lot of boys and men.
Suzy Shaw: So in this balance, there are always going to be times when you do need to step in too. So do you have any tips for how to recognize when to come in and how hard to come in?
Jason Larocque: That’s a good question. And I had a moment as a parent where one of my children was having some anxious times and anxious experiences. And I went to a credentialed, licensed mental health counselor that I know. And I said, “At what point do I step in and say we need therapy or at what point do I build some interventions that go beyond my capabilities and my experience?” And he said something I thought was really helpful. He said, “If it impacts the day-to-day life of the person.” So they’re not eating as much. They’re not sleeping. They have trouble being present. Their communication patterns are different. He said, “If it affects the day-to-day life of that person, then it’s something where we need to really take a more active role.”
And the other thing too is I like to think about the word “pattern.” In middle school, we know that the language of extremes happens. So like, “This is the worst day of my life.” Or like, “My friends are the worst.” And it’s like, “Well, is this a pattern or is it a moment?” Are we in this intense day and moment that you’re just kind of extrapolating? Or is this a pattern that extends multiple days, multiple touch points, multiple experiences, then that might require more activism and get into it?
And then the third type of intervention where I think we need to be a little more active is when there’s safety or security. And that could be anything. That could be thoughts that people are having. That could be just an environment. It could be addictive-type personalities, addictive behaviors. But anytime safety or security or well-being is in to play, I think that’s when we have to take a little bit more of an active approach. So again, I go back to safety, security patterns, and then I think about interruptions of daily functioning.
Suzy Shaw: And with your explaining of that with the safety and security, a memory came back to me of one of the boys’ friends who was cutting themselves and announced it on a bus, on the school bus. A lot of stuff happens on the school bus, especially in middle school. And it came back to me, and then I had to make a decision about what to do. And what I ended up saying was, “This is an adult problem. It’s not a problem for kids to—it’s not a kid-level problem.” And then I talked to the parents and just made sure they were aware, not in a confrontational, but in a concerned way. And I think when you think about mental health, there is this scale and some things are adult-level issues, and it’s clear: step in, don’t turn around and walk away. It’s a sign of help or a cry for help.
Jason Larocque: Yeah, exactly. In my world of Catholic education, there’s the parable of the Good Samaritan, which is like you never strand someone on the side of the road, no matter how difficult, challenging or intense. If you experience something, you hear something, or you see something and it doesn’t sit right, there’s multiple options to move forward with support. There’s personal outreach, there’s doing a wellness check through first responders. There’s a whole range continuum of responses, but I guess the worst response is to do nothing because we can’t control the outcomes when we do nothing.
Suzy Shaw: Agree very much. And when we talked, you also said to me that I thought it was interesting that sometimes instead of trying to fix the boy, the adult needs to be the one that’s trying to fix themselves and do a little bit of work on themselves. What do you mean by that?
Jason Larocque: So I think it’s a consciousness that we can develop a reflective nature to our relationships where we’re kind of looking at them from a top-down approach and saying like, what is happening in the relationship? And then realizing that as the adult, we’re the relationship manager. So if the relationship is not going well, it’s our responsibility to work on it. It’s not the child’s responsibility, who has limited abilities to meet our expectations perfectly because they don’t have the skills. So as the relationship manager, the teacher, the coach, the parent, the supervisor of the child, it’s our burden; it’s our responsibility to manage the health and quality of that relationship because if we expect the child to rise to the occasion, they just don’t know how.
Suzy Shaw: Right. They’re not there yet. And I think a big part of parenting is just demonstrating that you recognize all of these things that we were just talking about when you’re having a good day, when you’re having a bad day, being honest about it, when you need help.
One of the things that I use for myself, for my own emotional regulation, is something I call “soul putty.” And I feel like everybody’s soul has cracks in it. And for me, playing music- I play the guitar and sing. So playing music is my soul putty. I do it for myself. I don’t do it for other people. And I worked really hard to try to help my boys find whatever their soul putty was so that they didn’t have to rely on somebody else to feel better if they were feeling down- is it going for a run or a walk or playing an instrument, whatever it is. I think that emotional regulation, which I believe you were also saying, is really critical.
Jason Larocque: Yeah, I agree. Yeah. Helping boys with their inner worlds, I think is really important and making the connection between not being afraid of your inner world, naming and exploring and talking about how you’re feeling is really important. I think boys actually crave that space in that time. They just don’t know how to ask for it.
So, I have found the boys are the most responsive to me as a teacher when I honor their experience. And we honor their experience by creating safety and space for them to talk. It’s really important to create space for boys to talk and process their feelings. And once that fear is eliminated because they know it’s safe and there’s no judgment, they’ll do it more. And then it becomes a norm or an expectation of the relationship, but it’s getting over that fear of judgment.
I taught a junior class two years ago, and I asked the boys, what is the number one thing that gets in the way of you being totally authentic and having great relationships? And they said it’s fear of judgment across the board. It was unanimous. They all entered the same answer without coordinating their answer. And I think once you create a space where there’s not judgment, boys will tell you exactly how they feel, and they want that. They want to be seen, they want to be heard, they want to be valued, but it’s just so hard to create the conditions for that without intention that it very rarely happens.
Suzy Shaw: Do you have any tips for moms for how to create that space and explore those conversations?
Jason Larocque: I think what’s important is that when we have conversations with boys, we don’t try to script out what we want or what we try to say. I think it’s really trying to keep the conversation open-ended and allow them to express themselves. And for me, they want to talk about their identity. They want to talk about their challenges. They want to talk about their relationships. So it’s asking questions, it’s sitting with them. It’s not asking guided questions about what you want to know.
One of the things that we do in the junior class that I’ve taught is this thing called transformational interviewing, where we ask really provocative questions of people, and then we listen. And then by hearing the stories of people, we then become changed as a result of that listening because we understand a truth about them or about life.
So I think even having those types of questions, what are you afraid of? What are you afraid of? Do you want to know something I’m really afraid of? And then again, being vulnerable, it’s just, to me, vulnerability is contagious. It’s like contagious courage. Once I do it, you’re more likely to do it. Then it becomes an expectation that it’s safe. So for me, that vulnerability is really the secret ingredient.
Suzy Shaw: So in my book, I talk about a story that happened in high school. There were two groups of boys. It was in the summer, entirely too much time on these boys’ hands. And I won’t go into the details of the story because it’s really kind of funny from the outside. But at any rate, these two groups started picking on each other. I wouldn’t go as far as calling it attacking, but things were revving up and getting worse and worse. And so I asked the moms and the boys to come to our house to talk about it. And then I begged the moms not to talk. It’s like, we’re going to let them figure it out. And we sat on our hands, and our mouths closed. And they did. And the boys did talk with each other and expressed what they were doing and their actions. I think they can be remarkably honest and accountable when adults get out of the way and apologize to each other.
Jason Larocque: I think boys are inherently good once all the performative the social dynamics get stripped away. They’re in their natural state. There’s nothing to perform. There’s no hierarchy to try to fit into. And they’re wonderfully tender. They’re wonderfully honest. They are sincere. They’re emotional.
The same boys that I see out in the hallway in a crowded hallway in between classes, when you get them behind closed doors they act completely different. And I think we can hold boys accountable and still love them. And I think that a lot of times when we hold boys accountable, it’s like the shame kind of a thing or like a punishment, a punitive lens.
Suzy Shaw: Yeah, bad boy.
Jason Larocque: And for me, accountability is really about love. And when we make a mistake, it’s generally because we don’t love ourselves or we’re not loving someone else. So let’s get back to the love part of it instead of the punishment part. And I’m not saying there’s not ever consequences that are necessary, but I think we all want to be loved and love other people. And I think when we again, when we strip that performance stuff away, you get back to that core that core need for love and appreciation.
Suzy Shaw: So you have spent over two decades as an educator in all-boys schools. And so first off, I want to thank you because I think there’s a real lack of men in the school system, especially in elementary school, but it starts to increase as you get into middle school.
Jason Larocque: I appreciate that.
Suzy Shaw: So tell me, what do you wish more parents knew and that you’ve learned over these years?
Jason Larocque: This is a great question. And I would love to hear from a lot of other male or all-boys educators, male or female. But I think one of the things I was thinking about is that when boys are hurting, they very rarely tell you, but they signal. And that signaling might take the form of misbehavior. It might take the form of disengagement. It might take the form of not eating. It might take the form of avoidance, upset stomachs.
Sometimes boys will journal. I can’t tell you the number of times where there’s a journal prompt in a class, and the teacher will encounter a statement that is really hard to see or hear. Like, “No one likes me,” or, “I have no friends,” and they’re willing to write it in the journal because they know that someone will read it. But they don’t want to say it. They don’t want to come out and say, “I’m hurting.” So for me, I think boys are throwing up the Batman signal all the time for us. It’s just a matter of: A, are we open to being observant and accompanying them, like being present to them enough to know they’re not themselves? And then when we get the signaling, what do we do about it? Are we alarmist and we go into panic mode, or are we thoughtful and regulated when we try to work with that? I think that’s what I would want people to know that I’ve learned is that boys are really good at signaling, but they’re not very good at direct communication when they’re hurting.
Suzy Shaw: Mm-hmm. That’s a great tip, and I totally agree.
You’ve also talked about the wellness gap, especially among adult men. So I had two boys, I call them Earnest and Exuberance. Exuberance, I’ve never had a problem getting him to run around and do exercise and eat well. Earnest, on the other hand, that was a total challenge. And this balance of physical and emotional and mental health, do you have any tips for the Earnests of the world who would prefer to sit in their room and read a book, play a game?
Jason Larocque: I think about as a man in the space of working with all boys, I represent a finished product to them, and that’s a responsibility that I have. They’re watching me and other men and the females as the adult model of what we are aspiring to. And I get nervous when I see a lot of parents that are dads that are so wrapped up in their careers, that are always on their phone, that are not taking care of their physical health. And they might be really good parents. They might love their children a lot, but they’re leaving stuff on the shelf because the way they live is a lesson.
And I think that if we’re not taking care of our bodies, that sends a message. If we’re working 80-hour weeks, that sends a message. And it’s really challenging being a father and trying to navigate that work-life balance, being a mother and navigate that work-life balance. And it’s hard to pay attention to my physical health and get a workout in. But what I have learned is that I take care of myself as a parent- my health, social, emotional, physical, spiritual, all those things. I’m a better parent.
So for me, being a really good, loving parent is half the battle. Then you have to be a good, loving person to yourself because that is the other half. But men and women teach, especially if they work with boys as parents and as educators, they’re always teaching what a flourishing life looks like. And if it’s just working, if it’s just parenting, then we’re not modeling balance and wholeness for them. So I feel really strongly about that.
Suzy Shaw: So, and going back to the question about what to do with Earnest, it sounds like example one is: look inside and be a better model of balance.
Jason Larocque: Or we pursue balance together. Like, “Hey, you’re not doing so hot. I’m not either. Let’s go start running together. Let’s do a ceramics class together so that we can achieve some balance.” But I think, yeah, it’s either through modeling, or it’s through joint participation where we become healthy.
Suzy Shaw: So as I wrap up every single podcast, I ask our guests to give a motto of what a mom, the mothers of boys, the MOB can say as we raise our sons. Is there a motto that you lean into?
Jason Larocque: That’s a great question. I don’t have one that I use frequently, but I thought about what I would want to leave your listeners with. And I think it goes back to the accompaniment model, which is I think walk with them, don’t push them, and don’t pull them. Sometimes we push them because they’re not acting the way we want or we pull them because we’re trying to get them to a certain destination. And really what they’ll remember is, “Did you walk with me?” And walk with me in the good times, walk with me in the bad times. And are we moving together versus one of us always initiating the growth and the movement? So I would just say, “Walk with the boys.”
Suzy Shaw: Well, Jason, thank you for joining us. Are you on social media? Where do we find more to stay in tune with you?
Jason Larocque: You can find me on LinkedIn. You can find me on Instagram. I also have a website, coachlaroc.com, where my consulting and my facilitating of workshops and presentations, I talk about the things I do. So yeah, I’m happy to support anybody, whether it’s teams, whether it’s parent groups, whether it’s faculty members. I care very deeply about this, and I’m happy to expand the mission.
Suzy Shaw: And we will share all that information on the mothersofboys.life website. So thank you very much.
Jason Larocque: Thanks so much. Really appreciate it.
Suzy Shaw: If this episode meant something to you, please follow and share the Mothers of Boys Survival Guide podcast on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, and LinkedIn. Sharing helps other moms discover the show. Be kind to yourself, moms.
